2009 Jetta TDI Mil code P0401- EGR Insufficient flow

Discussion in 'Mk5 VW Jetta, Sportwagen, and Audi A3 TDI forum' started by jherrera, May 30, 2015.

  1. jherrera

    jherrera New Member

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    2009 jett TDI
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    Hello everyone, please excuse my ignorance as this is the first time I try to post something on a forum. I'm out here in NorCal.
    As you can see on the thread title, I have the check engine light on with that code. The dealer told me that it was the DPF but I am just not convinced because I have never got an indication that the DPF has regenerated or called for a regeneration, no instrument panel light, the cars runs as efficient as it did when I drove off the lot on day 1. I have cleaned the EGR tube( it was not plugged), I have replaced the EGR Valve (expensive!!).
    Does anyone know if there is some sort of reset that needs to be done when the EGR Valve gets replaced??? I've cleared the code with the regular OBDII scanner but it keeps coming back.
    I was able to get in touch with a person (Joe, SUPER NICE GUY!!!) out here who has a VCDS and took a few snap shots of the screens that show any values for the diesel particulate filter. We could not see any soot values anywhere. I'm gonna try to load them up and see if anyone out there can understand the values/numbers shown. Image 884 is what I saw when I was trying to see the soot load% but there were no values in the boxes. All the others actually say that they are related to the diesel particulate filter.

    latest update as of 6/11/2015
    my problems has finally been resolved. After all the info acquired from the membership, I was able to just do it and go for it. I replaced the EGR Filter as suggested and WHOALA!!! no more check engine. I was able to pass the CAL smog test today. MY DPF was and is fine. I'm glad I did not make the dealer suggested $2500 dpf replacement.
    Thanks to all who edviced on my issues.
     

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    Last edited: Jun 11, 2015
  2. jherrera

    jherrera New Member

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    Does anyone know how to do an Exhaust gas recirculation Adaptation reset on an 09 jetta tdi? Joe and I did some more analysis on Sunday and found the DPF to be good, not plugged at all. What we did was try to do a Reset the EGR valve learned values and the exhaust gas recirculation valve adaptation but I am not sure that we were successful. Here are some more snapshots.
     

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  3. mikeme

    mikeme Active Member

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    2009 JSW TDI 205,000 miles
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    There is a VW Technical Service bulletin TSB on the issue. for that error code, it says to pull the EGR filter, and check for soot in the input. any soot indicates that the DPF has a crack and that it, with the EGR filter, needs to be replaced.


    see: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=441008

    how does your tailpipe look?
    if there is any soot at all. (wipe inside with your finger or a paper towel), it means that DPF is cracked, and the cause of your worries.

    the soot levels are in Measuring blocks 241.

    see http://www.myturbodiesel.com/wiki/dpf-obd-charts/

    your car regenerates all the cats including the DPF, in a dance over the many thousands of miles on the car. in normal operation, it is subtle to notice any of them, easiest is if you come to a stop during a DPF regeneration and see the idle speed is a bit higher than normal.




    also, there are two loops for EGR, one high pressure, and one low pressure. The low pressure loop is the one from the DPF output, through the EGR filter, to the input of the combustion air side of the turbo.

    I think some of the other parts, including the sensor/actuator you adapted, are in the high pressure loop, which goes around to the front of the engine. sure would have been nice if VW had been consistent on labeling of sensors and actuators to make it easier to match values with readings.

    http://www.natef.org/NATEF/media/NATEFMedia/VW Files/2-0-TDI-SSP.pdf
    has plenty of info, and shows both the egr loops.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2015
  4. williamgd2

    williamgd2 Member

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    If you drive with that code for any length of time and don't need a dpf then you will definitely need one. So don't put that off. To reset the values in vcds go to engine then basic settings and it will be in the drop down box. To reset charge the value to 1
     
  5. Keithuk

    Keithuk Super Moderator

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    Please add an a to jett?

    VAG Error Code: 16785/001025


    EOBD II Error Code: P0401

    Fault Location:
    Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) System - Insufficient Flow Detected - Intermittent

    Possible Cause:
    Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL)(K83) active.
    Reduced Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR).
    Reduced Power Output/Engine running rough.
    Increased Emissions.

    Wiring/Connector(s).
    Hose leak/blockage.
    Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) Flow restricted/clogged.
    Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) Valve stuck closed/leaking/faulty.
    Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) System faulty.

    Possible Solutions:
    Check/Replace all faulty Wiring/Connector(s).
    Check/Clean Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) System.
    Read Measuring Value Blocks (MVB).
    Check/Replace Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) Valve.
    Control deviation < limit from map f (engine speed, desired airflow).

    Special Notes:
    When this fault is stored in a 2009-2012 North American Region (NAR) market 2.0L CR TDI (CBEA, CJAA, CKRA) VW Jetta/Golf (1K/AJ) or the NMS Passat (A3) chassis:
    Please see: Technical Service Bulletin (TSB) 26-13-03 | Technical Product Information (TPI) #2031583/3 (formerly know as 26-12-08 | Technical Product Information (TPI) #2031583). When the Exhaust Pressure Flap Control Module (J883) is faulty, the engine controller may have any of the following Diagnostic Trouble Codes (DTCs):
    P046F, P0477, P048A, P048B, P048C, P0401.
    Some TDI-CR engines have a filter for the Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) that can become restricted and cause a "Insufficient Flow" code.

    When this fault is stored in a 2009-2014 North American Region (NAR) market 2.0L CR TDI (CBEA or CJAA ) VW Jetta/Golf (1K/AJ).
    Please See Technical Product Information (TPI) 01 14 11 | #2034898
    May also have fault code stored in Engine Control Module (ECM).
    009315/P2463/009315 - Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF) - Excessive Soot Accumulation.
    Restrictions in the Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) Filter may occur after a regeneration, if the soot loads where high before the regeneration.

    Tech Notes:
    Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) flow malfunction could be caused by a clogged Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) valve or Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) tube. Before replacing any parts try cleaning the Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) valve, tube and passages.

    When is the code detected?:
    Low Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) flow control is detected.

    As taken from my Free EOBD II Error Codes software
     
  6. konyip

    konyip New Member

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    Hi Jherrara,

    Can you list how much it cost to replace the EGR filter (part and/or labor)? Do you recommend replacing the EGR valve as well?

    Thanks,
    Konyip.
     
  7. mikeme

    mikeme Active Member

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    So a little follow-on,

    if there was any soot in the EGR filter, (and likely soot on the inside of your tailpipe) it would indicate a cracked DPF.

    cracked DPFs will regenerate just fine, but the soot that gets by will clog up the EGR filter again. cleaning or changing the filter will get rid of the check engine light, but not for long.

    so plan ahead and be advised.
     
  8. xeno555

    xeno555 Well-Known Member

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    Are you claiming that the EGR gasses are collected after the DPF?
     
  9. mikeme

    mikeme Active Member

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  10. n2fastcars

    n2fastcars New Member

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    I'm having the p0401 code on my car and I'm seeing a slight film of soot on my finger after rubbing the inside of the tail pipe. So I took loose the egr filter pipe that hooks to the dpf filter and no soot as in the tail pipe but a film of oil in the egr filter pipe. What does this mean a cracked dpf filter as well.
     
  11. mikeme

    mikeme Active Member

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  12. mikeme

    mikeme Active Member

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    above from the VW TSB. (as of April 2014)
     
  13. n2fastcars

    n2fastcars New Member

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    Yeah thats what i have. Thank for posting the pictures. I cleaned the egr filter and code has been gone for a couple days now and still is. Im planning on doing a delete now. Is there a chance of me hurting the motor if i run it another 10 or 15,000 miles before doing the delete? The car has 119,000 mile on it. Thanks
     
  14. mikeme

    mikeme Active Member

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    you will get another error well before any damage to the car.

    you can get a VW rebuilt DPF for under $900. (just so you know) and not need any tune.

    Would need to find an NOX cat from someone, but still could come out cheaper than pipes and a tune.
     
  15. n2fastcars

    n2fastcars New Member

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    I didn't not know that there was anything like that available. I'm guessing the dealer would sale that? Thank you for all the info.
     
  16. mikeme

    mikeme Active Member

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    for a 2009, you have to substitute the parts for a 2010 to 2014, jetta, or golf.



    1K0-254-708-GX is the part number for the rebuilt DPF

    1K0-254-401-T is the NOX cat. this is the pricy one, but if you can get your hands on a used one, you can use the rebuilt DPF with it.

    most salvage yards may not sell it, since there are laws against selling used emissions parts. but a private owner or someone who installs the illegal substitute parts may be able to help you out.

    in the 2009, they are one part. in later years they made it two parts.

    below from: http://www.myturbodiesel.com/wiki/d...epair-cleaning-and-pictures-tdi/?noRedirect=1
    [​IMG]

    you can google the part numbers for options.

    the dealer should have them too, but would probably charge more than an online sale.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2015
  17. speedlaw

    speedlaw New Member

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    I just got bit on this one. 2012 TDI, manual. We love the car. Got the P0401 code, went to dealer....said new DPF, $2200 please.

    We hit the floor. After some discussion, VW agreed to goodwill half so I end up with a$1100 repair.

    The car has 83,500k so I'm JUST outside the Fed Warranty. VW said tough beyond that.

    I have soot in the tailpipe !!!!!

    Not thrilled. Car maintained perfectly with special VW oil at recommended intervals. Otherwise no real issues. Driven long distances, wound to redline, driven hard in places (long mountain uphills, etc)

    Soot in the tailpipe is a catastrophic failure of the emissions system. When will VW recall this one ? If I could DPF delete, stand back while I toss that sucker, but I cannot as I live in a strict emissions area and no CE light equals inspection sticker.

    Conspiracy theory...the 23O6 engine software is to prevent this issue.

    You just soured a perfect ownership experience, VW. I'm going to be writing a few letters to NHTSA and EPA.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2015
  18. mikeme

    mikeme Active Member

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    You also can just get a new EGR filter, which will clear that light.

    the leaky DPF will fill it again, but perhaps not for ten or twenty thousand miles.

    http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=4834622&postcount=18 might have a filter update that would go longer.

    the cracked DPF, by itself, or soot in the tailpipe, will not prevent catching and treating most of the soot, or make the light come on. (or make you fail inspection would be my guess)

    but $1100 is a better deal than you will get in another year.
     
  19. speedlaw

    speedlaw New Member

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    That, sir is Word, and I'll be making the appointment........at the end of the day everyone loves the black clatterwagon....

    Any ideas what I can do to prevent this again ? I'm gonna need a tdi guru just north of NYC....
     
  20. mikeme

    mikeme Active Member

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    Replacement of the DPF is the proper fix.

    you also could contact or at least bookmark http://www.dpfregeneration.com/, in case there is a next time. when I spoke with the owner, she said they were looking at establishing a capability to repair cracked DPFs.

    I have no idea of actions to take to reduce likelihood of additional cracks. in general, soot is reduced by keeping everything operating properly. more soot seems generated on first start-up, while coming to temperature, so avoid short trips, but this is pretty much good tdi advice anyway.
     

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